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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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Valid composing credit(s)? |
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| Registered: May 19, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 5,704 |
| | Posted: | | | | Why do we try to complexify (don't know if this word exists, otherwise it is a needed invention, obviously) our rules without any profit?
From my point of view it is totally useless to replace a simple IF-Then rule (IF the credit lists Music by, Music Composed by, Score by or Score Composed by, THEN list the person as composer) by a complex construction which can only be verified by research and/or insider information?
Why are people around here trying to make our lives harder? | | | | Complete list of Common Names • A good point for starting with Headshots (and v11.1) |
|   | T!M | | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 8,667 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting AiAustria: Quote:
Why are people around here trying to make our lives harder? I certainly wasn't suggesting a change. It's just noted that the contribution rules declare that the "Composer" credit is to be "used for the composer of the film's Original Score". Based on those rules, composers of non-original scores have routinely been left out and/or removed from the database. You're explaining what you feel is the simplest approach, and some of us may agree with you, we're just pointing out that's not what the current rules say. Nobody is "trying to make our lives harder" - instead, you're suggesting to make them simpler, that's something else. I understand that, but those pointing out that the current rules demand that the score is original aren't "trying to make our lives harder" - they're merely applying the current rules. If you want to make things simpler by dropping that particular requirement: by all means, campaign for it and try to get it scrapped from the rules. | | | | Last edited: by T!M |
| | Registered: May 19, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 5,704 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting T!M: Quote:
If you want to make things simpler by dropping that requirement: by all means, campaign for it and try to get it scrapped from the rules. Done. Please vote here | | | | Complete list of Common Names • A good point for starting with Headshots (and v11.1) |
| | T!M | | Profiling since Dec. 2000 |
| Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 8,667 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting AiAustria: Quote:
Please vote here Done. |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: |  Posts: 13,198 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting DoubleDownAgain: Quote:
Quoting dee1959jay:
Quote:
Screenplays are irrelevant for this discussion.
  Because you say so? I am not trying to apply any rules towards writing credits to Music credits. My point was that it doesn't matter when it was written. It has the proper credits, and there is no evidence from the credits that it isn't 'Original'. It is irrelevant because the comparison makes no sense. A screenplay is written for the sole purpose of being turned into a movie. Regardless of when it was written, if a screenplay is turned into a movie, it has served it's purpose and the writer gets credit for writing it. Quote:
Even if you are correct in using "Original" from the notes, and it means what you think it means, the onus would be on your to provide documentation to prove that the music used for the score wasn't original. From just viewing the credits, you have to take them at face value. First, why wouldn't you use 'Original' from the notes? The purpose of the notes is to clarify what the Profiler credit is supposed to capture. Second, what else could it mean? I did a Google search for the term "Original Score" and got the following: The Academy Award for Best Original Score is presented to the best substantial body of music in the form of dramatic underscoring written specifically for the film by the submitting composer. Do you have a different meaning? Third, since when do we take every credit at face value? There are a number of areas where we don't take the credits at face value...sound comes to mind. Fourth, the OP provided documentation that should be enough to prove the score wasn't original. I mean, common sense tells me that Cole Porter didn't write a score for a movie that was made 17 years after he died. If he did, he was one heck of a prognosticator. | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | Reputation:  |  Posts: 1,272 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Quoting DoubleDownAgain:
Quote:
Quoting dee1959jay:
Quote:
Screenplays are irrelevant for this discussion.
Because you say so? I am not trying to apply any rules towards writing credits to Music credits. My point was that it doesn't matter when it was written. It has the proper credits, and there is no evidence from the credits that it isn't 'Original'.
It is irrelevant because the comparison makes no sense. A screenplay is written for the sole purpose of being turned into a movie. Regardless of when it was written, if a screenplay is turned into a movie, it has served it's purpose and the writer gets credit for writing it. Wow, the comparison makes no sense? Besides two people working on a film? I brought up screenplays because they are both crew credits. You are making a couple of different assumptions. One is that the composer wasn't working on the score for the film. The second is that you seem to believe, correct me if I'm wrong, that music at the time it was written was intended to be used as a film score. If that is your position then I'd love to hear you state either by the Contribution rules. Either way if someone submited a contribution tor remove a credit I'd want to see proof that the score wasn't 'Original' Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Quote:
Even if you are correct in using "Original" from the notes, and it means what you think it means, the onus would be on your to provide documentation to prove that the music used for the score wasn't original. From just viewing the credits, you have to take them at face value.
First, why wouldn't you use 'Original' from the notes? The purpose of the notes is to clarify what the Profiler credit is supposed to capture. I was refereing to the notes in the rules, not the contribution. As I stated before I'd expect notes in the contribution field to state why an otherwise valid credit should be removed. Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Second, what else could it mean? I did a Google search for the term "Original Score" and got the following: The Academy Award for Best Original Score is presented to the best substantial body of music in the form of dramatic underscoring written specifically for the film by the submitting composer. Do you have a different meaning? Why would you google that? The rules clearly state: "Music by, Music Composed by, Score by, Score Composed by" why on earth do you need to google it? Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Third, since when do we take every credit at face value? There are a number of areas where we don't take the credits at face value...sound comes to mind. Huh? So you should only take the rules at face value when??? Quoting TheMadMartian: Quote:
Fourth, the OP provided documentation that should be enough to prove the score wasn't original. I mean, common sense tells me that Cole Porter didn't write a score for a movie that was made 17 years after he died. If he did, he was one heck of a prognosticator. Common Sense? Really?  | | | HDTV: 52" Toshiba Regza 52XV545U AVR: Onkyo TR-707
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| | Registered: March 13, 2007 | | Reputation: | | Posts: 13,198 |
| | Posted: | | | | Quoting DoubleDownAgain: Quote:
Wow, the comparison makes no sense? Besides two people working on a film?
I brought up screenplays because they are both crew credits. Except they didn't both work on the film. Yes, the screenwriter worked on the film, but a guy who died 17 years before the film was ever released, did not. So yes, in the context of this thread, the comparison makes no sense. Quote:
You are making a couple of different assumptions. One is that the composer wasn't working on the score for the film. I am taking the OP at his word. It is not an assumption to believe that a composer, who died 17 years before the film was made, wasn't working on the score for that film. At worst, it is an educated guess. Quote:
The second is that you seem to believe, correct me if I'm wrong, that music at the time it was written was intended to be used as a film score. If that is your position then I'd love to hear you state either by the Contribution rules. From the rules: "Used for the composer of the film's Original Score." Seems pretty straightforward to me. Quote:
Either way if someone submited a contribution tor remove a credit I'd want to see proof that the score wasn't 'Original' He died 17 years before the film was made. Again, seems pretty straightforward to me. Quote:
I was refereing to the notes in the rules, not the contribution. As I stated before I'd expect notes in the contribution field to state why an otherwise valid credit should be removed. The notes in the rules do explain why it should be removed. Per the notes in the rules, for that credit to be valid, it has to be the person who wrote the film's Original Score." Quote:
Why would you google that? The rules clearly state: "Music by, Music Composed by, Score by, Score Composed by" why on earth do you need to google it? Because the rules also clearly state, "Used for the composer of the film's Original Score" and you questioned whether or not that meant what dee1959jay thought it meant. I was just pointing out the fact that it did. Quote:
Huh? So you should only take the rules at face value when??? I said 'credits', not rules, as did you. This is an important distinction because I am, in fact, taking the rules at face value. When they tell me that the Music by, Music Composed by, Score by, and Score Composed by are to be "used for the composer of the film's Original Score," I take that at face value. Quote:
Common Sense? Really? Yes, really...unless your argument is that Cole Porter wrote music specifically for a film that wasn't going to be made until 17 years after he died.  | | | No dictator, no invader can hold an imprisoned population by force of arms forever.
There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom.
Against this power, governments and tyrants and armies cannot stand.
The Centauri learned this lesson once.
We will teach it to them again.
Though it take a thousand years, we will be free.
- Citizen G'Kar |
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Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion |
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