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    Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion Page: 1 2 3 ...5  Previous   Next
Method to determine the "production year"
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorTigiHof
Keep your options open
Registered: March 13, 2007
Germany Posts: 465
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I'm sorry to bother the community with yet another poll, but currently some important rules are being revised in the contributions rules committee, and I have got the opinion that it's always best to obtain the vote of the users before decisions are made (of course Ken always has the final say).

So, here is the problem:

The current rule for the production year of a film states "Enter the year of the original theatrical release. For films that have been updated (e.g., a Special Edition or Directors Cut) use the year of the original release, not the year that the re-release was “made” or released."

The current rule proposal for the production year of a TV series looks like this: "Use the year of the earliest aired episode in the set / on the disc."

I've always had a problem with the first rule and even more so with the new rule proposal for TV series. Why ? Because the contributor needs to get information from a third party site when this is absolutely not necessary. Every movie and every TV episode I have ever seen has a copyright notice with a production year at the end. I haven't got the slightest clue why this shouldn't be used for the profiles. It's indisputable and easy to find.

Why should we have to look up the first air date for a TV episode on the internet ? Besides, what does "first air date" mean ? The first broadcast in the country of origin ? The country of origin for "Battlestar Galactica" is the United States but still the first season aired months earlier in the UK.

So, I suggest changes to "Enter the year of the copyright date from the film credits" and "Enter the year of the earliest copyright date from the episode credits in the set / on the disc."

What is your opinion about that ?
Michael
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorhydr0x
Registered: April 4, 2007
Germany Posts: 822
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I'm all for it, been using copyright year locally all the time! It's always better to be able to take the info from the movie/disc than from some internet site.

We have to consider movies without a copyright year (just watched Le Mepris/Contempt and didn't notice a year anywhere). For those the current rule should apply.
- Jan
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar Contributorhal9g
Who is John Galt?
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: High Rating
United States Posts: 6,635
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Completely agree.  In order to prevent inconsistency and to use the only true source material to populate this field and remove all ambiguity, using the copyright date directly from the DVD itself is the most practical solution!
Hal
 Last edited: by hal9g
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorNewEnglander
Registered: 11/13/2003
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: High Rating
United States Posts: 1,911
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I voted to leave the rules as is.

You cannot say without a shadow of doubt that all DVD's will have copyright informationa at the end of the credits.

For TV Shows...

Do you use Episode #1 or episode #22? Why?

What if #1 is 1982 and #22 is 1983?

Most tv seasons (in the U.S.) run from Sept to June (two different years).

I say let the rules stay as they are. Why complicate things.
Signature banned: Reason out of date...
 Last edited: by NewEnglander
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantW0m6at
You're in for it now Tony
Registered: April 17, 2007
Australia Posts: 1,091
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I'm for going from the copyright.  I don't like any of the sections where you have to use third-party sites or speculation.  I've encountered conflicting data on release dates from different sites.  Also, many "cult" movies have a long run at film festivals before being picked up for release, complicating matters.
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DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantTouti
Registered: March 13, 2007
Canada Posts: 582
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I'm for it to but you have to cover the problem of movies that may not have a copyright/production year in the end credits.  In this case I would use the year printed on the back of the DVD as a fall back.
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorDarxon
Vescere bracis meis
Registered: March 14, 2007
Germany Posts: 742
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I agree with taking the copyright date, it more consitent, easier to find and comes from the DVD (if available) and not some third party.

But don't forget to include later editions, recuts, etc. in the rules as well to avoid more endless discussions on interpretation, please...
Lutz
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorPatorikku
Registered: March 29, 2007
Canada Posts: 402
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Keep "theatrical release" and "first air date" as methods for determining the production year

This I like so it easy to search (to knows if one movie was realese before a other movie)
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorErik
It's a strange world.
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: Great Rating
Norway Posts: 422
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Copyright date sounds good (long as it can be found on some world cinema flicks...)

PS.  Can we please discount Harry Knowles' Austin Film thing as a production year?
Erik

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DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar Contributorhal9g
Who is John Galt?
Registered: March 13, 2007
Reputation: High Rating
United States Posts: 6,635
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Quoting Ralliart:
Quote:
Keep "theatrical release" and "first air date" as methods for determining the production year

This I like so it easy to search (to knows if one movie was realese before a other movie)


I think a Feature Request should be submitted in the correct forum for a field called "Theatrical Release" and "Aired Date" if people actually want to capture that information.

The current title of the field is "Production Year" and the copyright in the film's credits is the only authoritative source for that information.
Hal
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorPatorikku
Registered: March 29, 2007
Canada Posts: 402
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Quoting hal9g:
Quote:
Quoting Ralliart:
Quote:
Keep "theatrical release" and "first air date" as methods for determining the production year

This I like so it easy to search (to knows if one movie was realese before a other movie)


I think a Feature Request should be submitted in the correct forum for a field called "Theatrical Release" and "Aired Date" if people actually want to capture that information.

The current title of the field is "Production Year" and the copyright in the film's credits is the only authoritative source for that information.


I see your point of view and I like it. So added more feild will be great 
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantRifter
Reg. Jan 27, 2002
Registered: March 13, 2007
United States Posts: 2,694
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There is no good reason to use copyright date.  Copyright doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the actual date the film was made.  Copyright could just as easily be the date of the screenplay, or the date the production company was formed, or any of a dozen other things.

The universal standard is theatrical release date.  Virtually every database uses that date when you look up a movie.  Now you want to change canoes in midstream and force the change of virually every profile in the database with a different date that may or may not be present in the credits of a movie or TV show.
John

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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorWinston Smith
Don't be discommodious
Registered: March 13, 2007
United States Posts: 21,610
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They are very good at that, john.

Skip
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Billy Video
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorhydr0x
Registered: April 4, 2007
Germany Posts: 822
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Quoting Rifter:
Quote:
There is no good reason to use copyright date.  Copyright doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the actual date the film was made.  Copyright could just as easily be the date of the screenplay, or the date the production company was formed, or any of a dozen other things.


huh? where do take this info from? I've never seen any indication that a copyright year was any of the things you mentioned. In fact I've seen additional screenplay/music copyright years in a lot of movies. Year the company was formed? Sorry but that's a ridiculous unrealistic "example" taken out of nowhere.

And your contradicting yourself: You say it can't be used because it doesn't always match the actual date the film was made. Well, guess what, neither does the current rule. Movies often get postponed because of some events (9/11, WWII...). They also are often released a year later than the actual shooting took place. So if you want to capture the date of production you're definitely closer with the copyright year on average.

If you want to document the aired date too that's understandable (but it is the less important of the two imho) but we need a new field for that.
- Jan
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorWinston Smith
Don't be discommodious
Registered: March 13, 2007
United States Posts: 21,610
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hydrox:

The copyright date of a film may have absolutely nothing to do with the release date. It is not unusual for some films to sit on a shelf for years after filming in search of a distributor. I such cases the copyright date and theatrical have little or nothing in common and I would say the theatrical release(problematic, to be sure) would be the more useful.

Skip
ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here

Billy Video
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantGrendell
One disc at a time...
Registered: May 8, 2007
United States Posts: 823
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The rule as it is and has been is inconsistent and does not make sense. Even now, the field is called "Produced." The year for a field with this name should come from the credits as seen from the film on the disc itself.

The rules however state to pull the first or theatrical release date. Therefore the field should be changed to "release date," "theatrical release date," or "first released."
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