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    Invelos Forums->DVD Profiler: Contribution Discussion Page: 1 2 3 4 5  Previous   Next
Discussion on International titles vs. Original title for the Main Title field for Asian Films
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DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar Contributorwhispering
On ne passe pas!
Registered: March 13, 2007
Finland Posts: 1,380
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Quoting Peter von Frosta:
Quote:
So? I've explicitly said only if the international title is shown on the cover and/or in the credits.


You missed my point, even if the IntTitle was used on every single movie released in Korea, it would still be wrong. But my point was to show that these are very rare cases, making a ridiculous change, that in the end would only affect few titles, is stupid. Along with the fact it being incorrect.

Quoting DJ Doena:
Quote:
Pirates of the Carribean: The Curse of the Black Pearl - Fluch der Karabik - Curse of the Carribean (don't even ask about Part 2 and 3)

Here its: "Pirates of the Carribean: mustan helmen kirous", so they only translated the sub title.

Sometimes they use a dual title like: "Species - Peto" or "Spider-Man - hämähäkkimies"

...or often they just use the original title, like it whas with e.g. "i, Robot", "Jurassic Park" etc

But those are not 2 diffrent titles, those are just one title. Though i have encountered one problem with our system. For the movie Gawi, they used the international title and the original title on the cover, neither match with the locality, so which one to use? Of course the OT was used just to show some cool Asian signs, but still.
 Last edited: by whispering
DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantxradman
Registered: June 17, 2002
Registered: March 14, 2007
United States Posts: 1,328
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Quoting skipnet50:
Quote:
Let me try to explain from a different angle, xradman. Since much of my life these days is wrapped up in politics in Wash. D.C. You are wanting to have profiles treated differently within Region 1 because you are a native Korean. It's kind of like moving to the United States and trying to demand the population learn to speak Korean in order to communicate with you...that isn't going to happen obviously. As I have explained, were I purchasing a Region 5 Korea film, for Contribution purposes I would NOT be demanding that Region 5 users follow me, I would be following the Rules as they apply to Region 5, which means the data Contributed should be in Korean, I suspect. I would definitely keep my local data on that title in English but I would not Contribute the English data, which is what you are wanting to do here by my understanding. I am sorry but that is simply wrong-headed thinking on your part, and to make matters worse you come across as if you are PERSONALLY offended that we don't bend to your will, as you said this is a hobby roll with it and stop trying to make demands, which is the way your approach hits me. You aren't making a request, you are making a demand and expect us to bow to you on it.

If I have misjudged you, I apologize, but you have discussed this now for two years and from Day One this is how I have seen what you are saying.

Skip


Skip,

You of all person should understand the need for DVDP to serve all people. Either you haven't been getting enough sleep or you are confusing things around. I will summarize what I surmise are your misunderstandings or to clarify what I've been saying.

1. I was never personally offended. It seemed that Whispering got personally offended at the discussion thread and my proposal to include International titles. I simply said, hey take it easy, no need to get upset and personal about it.

2. I am not demanding anything. I am opening a discussion to see if we can include official International tiltle into the current database somehow. If not, then that's fine. Life will go on. I am sure Ken will eventually include this in the future.  We track practically everything.  Official international title should be at least as important.

3. I am not demanding everyone learn Korean or English. All I am proposing for discussion (that's right. this is a discussion thread. see the title at the top) is that if there is an international title (and this is often in English) for that release in local language, and there is an empty original title field (because the main title and local title are the same) then perhaps we can put that international title into the original title field (if rules would be flexible enough to allow alternate titles or recognize that official international title is also part of the original title). Proposing something and demanding something are two different things. I am not demanding that everyone go out and do what I am proposing.

4. Actually what I said 2 years ago and what I am saying now are quite different. Two or three years ago, I was asking for unicode support and stating that R3 Korean DVD should be entered in Korean. Short of that I asked that romanized titles be used in lieu of English titles.  In fact, at that time, I got quite a bit of response from you, John, and others that DVDP is an American program and if I didn't like that it was English centric, that I could go take a hike.  So here I am, proposing that international title in English be INCLUDED in the profile, and now I am getting slammed by the other point of view... How ironic  

5. So why am I bringing this up. It's simple. This new program seem like a fresh start. Gerri and Ken seem responsive to people's concern and questions. Hey, if Ken or Gerri says what we have currently and current interpretation of the rules is absolutely correct, I have no beef.

6. As others have pointed out, Korea is Region 3 for SD DVD, and Region A for Blu-ray. Yeah

Thanks for reading
My Home Theater
 Last edited: by xradman
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantPeter von Frosta
Registered: March 14, 2007
Germany Posts: 452
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Quoting DJ Doena:
Quote:
Quoting RHo:
Quote:
German marketing guys have funny ideas.

Die Hard - Strib Langsam - Die Slowly

...

Live Free or Die Hard - Strib Langsam 4.0

Watched too many striptease movies in the last days, eh
 Last edited: by Peter von Frosta
DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantxradman
Registered: June 17, 2002
Registered: March 14, 2007
United States Posts: 1,328
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Quoting Kulju:
Quote:
Quoting xradman:
Quote:

All rules can be discussed.


Yes, but what you are suggesting is just plain stupid.

Hey, hey, hey, only my wife is allowed to call me that.
My Home Theater
DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantxradman
Registered: June 17, 2002
Registered: March 14, 2007
United States Posts: 1,328
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Quoting whispering:
Quote:
What you usually see is that, no international title on the cover (well except one of them, kind of ):


She's on Duty
My Home Theater
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantPeter von Frosta
Registered: March 14, 2007
Germany Posts: 452
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Quoting xradman:
Quote:
Quoting whispering:
Quote:
What you usually see is that, no international title on the cover (well except one of them, kind of ):


She's on Duty

Right, it's on the cover.
But the movie sucks anyway
 Last edited: by Peter von Frosta
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar ContributorDJ Doena
Battle Troll
Registered: March 14, 2007
Reputation: Highest Rating
Germany Posts: 6,419
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Quoting Peter von Frosta:
Quote:
Watched too many striptease movies in the last days, eh
It's just a case of a faster left than right hand
Karsten
DVD Collectors Online
Amazon Price Observer

DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorKulju
Registered: March 14, 2007
Finland Posts: 2,337
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Quoting xradman:
Quote:
Quoting Kulju:
Quote:
Quoting xradman:
Quote:

All rules can be discussed.


Yes, but what you are suggesting is just plain stupid.

Hey, hey, hey, only my wife is allowed to call me that.


I didn't say that you are stupid, only the the idea you proposed 
DVD Profiler Desktop and Mobile RegistrantStar Contributorschultzy
Xbox Live: squeekyfoot
Registered: March 13, 2007
United States Posts: 550
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Quoting RHo:
Quote:
Quoting whispering:
Quote:
What you usually see is that, no international title on the cover

In those cases the main title should be the romanized version of what you see on the cover.

The international title can only be used for the original title field, if the international title has been used at the world premiere.


By romanized version, you are not referring to phonetic?  So in let's say japanese has the word "dog" in it, inu.  You would put "inu" in the title and not something like "dogu".

Also, maybe I missed this, but from what I am getting most are talking about how it shows up on the cover, but the rules say use what is used in the credits.  So what about when the credits show two titles.  Bayside Shakedown 2 international release says that on the cover.  But in the credits is shows Odoru daisousasen 2 and then changes to Bayside Shakedown 2.  So right now it is in the database as Odoru daisousasen 2 (Bayside Shakedown 2) because that is what is showed in the credits.


(which reminds me that I need to submit new scans)
Schultzy - http://www.michaelschultz.net
grenactics - The art of skillfully fraggin one’s opponent with the use of grenades or other compact explosive devices that are thrown by hand or projected.
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorWinston Smith
Don't be discommodious
Registered: March 13, 2007
United States Posts: 21,610
Posted:
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Quoting xradman:
Quote:
Quoting skipnet50:
Quote:
Let me try to explain from a different angle, xradman. Since much of my life these days is wrapped up in politics in Wash. D.C. You are wanting to have profiles treated differently within Region 1 because you are a native Korean. It's kind of like moving to the United States and trying to demand the population learn to speak Korean in order to communicate with you...that isn't going to happen obviously. As I have explained, were I purchasing a Region 5 Korea film, for Contribution purposes I would NOT be demanding that Region 5 users follow me, I would be following the Rules as they apply to Region 5, which means the data Contributed should be in Korean, I suspect. I would definitely keep my local data on that title in English but I would not Contribute the English data, which is what you are wanting to do here by my understanding. I am sorry but that is simply wrong-headed thinking on your part, and to make matters worse you come across as if you are PERSONALLY offended that we don't bend to your will, as you said this is a hobby roll with it and stop trying to make demands, which is the way your approach hits me. You aren't making a request, you are making a demand and expect us to bow to you on it.

If I have misjudged you, I apologize, but you have discussed this now for two years and from Day One this is how I have seen what you are saying.

Skip


Skip,

You of all person should understand the need for DVDP to serve all people. Either you haven't been getting enough sleep or you are confusing things around. I will summarize what I surmise are your misunderstandings or to clarify what I've been saying.

1. I was never personally offended. It seemed that Whispering got personally offended at the discussion thread and my proposal to include International titles. I simply said, hey take it easy, no need to get upset and personal about it.

2. I am not demanding anything. I am opening a discussion to see if we can include official International tiltle into the current database somehow. If not, then that's fine. Life will go on. I am sure Ken will eventually include this in the future.  We track practically everything.  Official international title should be at least as important.

3. I am not demanding everyone learn Korean or English. All I am proposing for discussion (that's right. this is a discussion thread. see the title at the top) is that if there is an international title (and this is often in English) for that release in local language, and there is an empty original title field (because the main title and local title are the same) then perhaps we can put that international title into the original title field (if rules would be flexible enough to allow alternate titles or recognize that official international title is also part of the original title). Proposing something and demanding something are two different things. I am not demanding that everyone go out and do what I am proposing.

4. Actually what I said 2 years ago and what I am saying now are quite different. Two or three years ago, I was asking for unicode support and stating that R3 Korean DVD should be entered in Korean. Short of that I asked that romanized titles be used in lieu of English titles.  In fact, at that time, I got quite a bit of response from you, John, and others that DVDP is an American program and if I didn't like that it was English centric, that I could go take a hike.  So here I am, proposing that international title in English be INCLUDED in the profile, and now I am getting slammed by the other point of view... How ironic  

5. So why am I bringing this up. It's simple. This new program seem like a fresh start. Gerri and Ken seem responsive to people's concern and questions. Hey, if Ken or Gerri says what we have currently and current interpretation of the rules is absolutely correct, I have no beef.

6. As others have pointed out, Korea is Region 3 for SD DVD, and Region A for Blu-ray. Yeah

Thanks for reading


Xradman:

The DVD Region Map I was dealing with was hard to decipher, but Region 3, Region 5 doesn't change the concept.

Then look to your self and how you come across. I was explaining to me how your posts have struck and I said if I have misjudged you I apologize. But that is how you are striking me. It is not for Americans to learn Korean so that they can talk to you as I noted in my analogy, and DVDProfiler is no different. You are purchasing, evidently other Region films and wanting to apply thoise standards to Region 1 data. Like I said that is just wrong-headed thinking. You CAN do what you want locally, do that and be happy.

Skip
ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here

Billy Video
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorWinston Smith
Don't be discommodious
Registered: March 13, 2007
United States Posts: 21,610
Posted:
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Quoting skipnet50:
Quote:
Quoting xradman:
Quote:
Quoting skipnet50:
Quote:
Let me try to explain from a different angle, xradman. Since much of my life these days is wrapped up in politics in Wash. D.C. You are wanting to have profiles treated differently within Region 1 because you are a native Korean. It's kind of like moving to the United States and trying to demand the population learn to speak Korean in order to communicate with you...that isn't going to happen obviously. As I have explained, were I purchasing a Region 5 Korea film, for Contribution purposes I would NOT be demanding that Region 5 users follow me, I would be following the Rules as they apply to Region 5, which means the data Contributed should be in Korean, I suspect. I would definitely keep my local data on that title in English but I would not Contribute the English data, which is what you are wanting to do here by my understanding. I am sorry but that is simply wrong-headed thinking on your part, and to make matters worse you come across as if you are PERSONALLY offended that we don't bend to your will, as you said this is a hobby roll with it and stop trying to make demands, which is the way your approach hits me. You aren't making a request, you are making a demand and expect us to bow to you on it.

If I have misjudged you, I apologize, but you have discussed this now for two years and from Day One this is how I have seen what you are saying.

Skip


Skip,

You of all person should understand the need for DVDP to serve all people. Either you haven't been getting enough sleep or you are confusing things around. I will summarize what I surmise are your misunderstandings or to clarify what I've been saying.

1. I was never personally offended. It seemed that Whispering got personally offended at the discussion thread and my proposal to include International titles. I simply said, hey take it easy, no need to get upset and personal about it.

2. I am not demanding anything. I am opening a discussion to see if we can include official International tiltle into the current database somehow. If not, then that's fine. Life will go on. I am sure Ken will eventually include this in the future.  We track practically everything.  Official international title should be at least as important.

3. I am not demanding everyone learn Korean or English. All I am proposing for discussion (that's right. this is a discussion thread. see the title at the top) is that if there is an international title (and this is often in English) for that release in local language, and there is an empty original title field (because the main title and local title are the same) then perhaps we can put that international title into the original title field (if rules would be flexible enough to allow alternate titles or recognize that official international title is also part of the original title). Proposing something and demanding something are two different things. I am not demanding that everyone go out and do what I am proposing.

4. Actually what I said 2 years ago and what I am saying now are quite different. Two or three years ago, I was asking for unicode support and stating that R3 Korean DVD should be entered in Korean. Short of that I asked that romanized titles be used in lieu of English titles.  In fact, at that time, I got quite a bit of response from you, John, and others that DVDP is an American program and if I didn't like that it was English centric, that I could go take a hike.  So here I am, proposing that international title in English be INCLUDED in the profile, and now I am getting slammed by the other point of view... How ironic  

5. So why am I bringing this up. It's simple. This new program seem like a fresh start. Gerri and Ken seem responsive to people's concern and questions. Hey, if Ken or Gerri says what we have currently and current interpretation of the rules is absolutely correct, I have no beef.

6. As others have pointed out, Korea is Region 3 for SD DVD, and Region A for Blu-ray. Yeah

Thanks for reading


Xradman:

The DVD Region Map I was dealing with was hard to decipher, but Region 3, Region 5 doesn't change the concept.

Then look to your self and how you come across. I was explaining to me how your posts have struck and I said if I have misjudged you I apologize. But that is how you are striking me. It is not for Americans to learn Korean so that they can talk to you as I noted in my analogy, and DVDProfiler is no different. You are purchasing, evidently other Region films and wanting to apply thoise standards to Region 1 data. Like I said that is just wrong-headed thinking. You CAN do what you want locally, do that and be happy.

Quote:
I am not demanding that everyone go out and do what I am proposing


Discussing it as a change to the Rules, is precisely what you are doing. If you aren't demanding that everyone do what you want them to, then you already have the power, it's your local database and you can set it up anyway you wish. You can list titles in Region 11 Mars  for all anyone cares its YOUR data, you just can't Contribute, but the Online and how the data is handled affects EVERY user and how the basic data is entered.

Skip
ASSUME NOTHING!!!!!!
CBE, MBE, MoA and proud of it.
Outta here

Billy Video
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorRHo
Registered: March 13, 2007
Posts: 2,759
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Quoting schultzy:
Quote:
By romanized version, you are not referring to phonetic?

No, I have no idea how to "romanize" any Asian language. What I mean by romanized is the representation of any text originally set in non-roman characters in a form using only the roman alphabet. While I'm aware that there could be more than one possible romanization of any Asian text, I do hope that there is at least a de facto standard which we could consent here.
DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantxradman
Registered: June 17, 2002
Registered: March 14, 2007
United States Posts: 1,328
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Quoting skipnet50:
Quote:
Xradman:

The DVD Region Map I was dealing with was hard to decipher, but Region 3, Region 5 doesn't change the concept.

Then look to your self and how you come across. I was explaining to me how your posts have struck and I said if I have misjudged you I apologize. But that is how you are striking me. It is not for Americans to learn Korean so that they can talk to you as I noted in my analogy, and DVDProfiler is no different. You are purchasing, evidently other Region films and wanting to apply thoise standards to Region 1 data. Like I said that is just wrong-headed thinking. You CAN do what you want locally, do that and be happy.

Skip


Skip,

I still don't think you are straight about this. Either that or your words are not conveying what your brain is thinking. I never said anything about modifying Region 1 data.

For the last time, I know I can do what I want locally. I'll tell you what. I'll tell you a secret. There is a small number of users who are doing just that. If you want Korean, Chinese, Japanese or any other language that is not supported by traditional roman alphabets, all you have to do is to set your language region for non-unicode programs to whatever language you want in the regional setting option in the Windows control panel. Once you do that, you can enter anything in any field in DVDP in Korean, Chinese, Japanese, or whatever you set your language to. You can have exact titles, names, notes,etc. Only downside is that no one else who isn't using your language locality can make sense of your data.  This would be a perfect solution for those who demand perfect accuracy in their DVD profile.

Am I advocating such drastic measures? No. I don't think it's good for the community to be so exclusive. Rather than saying that's a stupid idea, please suggest other options to be more inclusive.
My Home Theater
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantPeter von Frosta
Registered: March 14, 2007
Germany Posts: 452
Posted:
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Quoting skipnet50:
Quote:
Discussing it as a change to the Rules, is precisely what you are doing. If you aren't demanding that everyone do what you want them to, then you already have the power, it's your local database and you can set it up anyway you wish. You can list titles in Region 11 Mars  for all anyone cares its YOUR data, you just can't Contribute, but the Online and how the data is handled affects EVERY user and how the basic data is entered.

Skip

Are you serious, you want to forbid discussing a possible rule change proposal? Thank god you don't have too many supporters anymore
DVD Profiler Unlimited RegistrantStar ContributorRHo
Registered: March 13, 2007
Posts: 2,759
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Quoting schultzy:
Quote:
Also, maybe I missed this, but from what I am getting most are talking about how it shows up on the cover, but the rules say use what is used in the credits.  So what about when the credits show two titles.  Bayside Shakedown 2 international release says that on the cover.  But in the credits is shows Odoru daisousasen 2 and then changes to Bayside Shakedown 2.  So right now it is in the database as Odoru daisousasen 2 (Bayside Shakedown 2) because that is what is showed in the credits.

You are correct about cover vs. credits. But with the modified title rule (There's Something More About Mary) this point has become moot and you can put whatever you see on the cover into the main (modified) title field. Therefore in your example I would put "Bayside Shakedown 2" into the main title field according the modified title rule and either "Odoru daisousasen 2 - Bayside Shakedown 2" or "Odoru daisousasen 2" into the original title field depending what title has been used at the world premiere.
DVD Profiler Unlimited Registrantxradman
Registered: June 17, 2002
Registered: March 14, 2007
United States Posts: 1,328
Posted:
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Quoting schultzy:
Quote:
By romanized version, you are not referring to phonetic?  So in let's say japanese has the word "dog" in it, inu.  You would put "inu" in the title and not something like "dogu".

Also, maybe I missed this, but from what I am getting most are talking about how it shows up on the cover, but the rules say use what is used in the credits.  So what about when the credits show two titles.  Bayside Shakedown 2 international release says that on the cover.  But in the credits is shows Odoru daisousasen 2 and then changes to Bayside Shakedown 2.  So right now it is in the database as Odoru daisousasen 2 (Bayside Shakedown 2) because that is what is showed in the credits.


(which reminds me that I need to submit new scans)


Is this R2 Japan DVD or DVD for a different region?  If it's a non-Japan DVD, then Bayside Shakedown 2 would be the correct main title for this DVD with Odoru daisousasen 2 as the original title. I don't think it matters what it says on the screen in this instance.
My Home Theater
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